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[Dev Diary] Guilds


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#1
Remztan

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The following was just posted on our dev diary:

So, where to begin? I believe an apology is in order first. I am sincerely sorry for not keeping all of you up to date during this last development cycle. To fix this I am I am planning to have a weekly chat maybe on our mumble channel with anyone that would like to chat and ask questions. This way you’ll always know the latest.

As many of you may or may not know as a small indie shop we have been having a harder time financially and so development has really slowed down. Many of us here wear multiple hats and I’ve been deep in the trenches trying to get Guilds out. We’ve had numerous very frustrating setbacks but it is finally in a spot where I feel confident about it’s imminent release to talk more about it.

So, what is Guilds in the Forge universe? When we first started designing Guilds we read the forums and talked to many of you about what you’d like to see in Forge Guilds. We’ve built a foundation for Guilds that will allow us to easily add more Guild features. This foundation includes a Guild management system, Guild Play system, and Guild Progression. Guilds are all about working together as a team to earn XP for your Guild that allows your Guild to level up. It is meant as a place for you to play with your friends and to encourage more teamwork during play then we’re seeing in public matches.

The Guild management system is a very basic system that will allow you to create, edit, join, browse, and view Guilds. It has a leaderboard system based on guild experience and a recent match area to view recent matches and their outcomes. The Guild page itself has MVP, member rankings based on contributed XP, viewing all members, recent games, and the Guild Master can post daily messages. In order to prevent too many guilds and not enough players, and because guild logo’s are custom made and we have a finite number we will be charging a small fee to create a guild. We haven’t decided on an exact figure, but it will probably be just too much for someone to just want to test creating one and not seriously use it but not too much that if someone genuinely wants to form a guild they can. Please feel free to give feedback on what you think the fee should be. Guilds are free to join.

In the beginning we will be limiting Guild Play to only 5v5 CTR game mode. This is because if we offer more modes to start with it will separate the community for matchmaking making getting into games harder. We have no problem adding more games types if Guilds really takes off. But to start we’re only offering 5v5 CTR. I’m actually really excited because I really like to play objective based modes where teammates all have a role and know exactly what to do. My hope is that with Guilds and forming teams to play that you will assign roles before going into a match creating very exciting gameplay.

The last piece of the Guilds puzzle is progression. There are 25 levels and each level gives your guild some kind of reward. Anyone who joins a Guild immediately gets all of the Guild progression rewards – but if you leave a Guild you also loose your rewards. Rewards range from individual XP boosts (which in turn generate more Ore), skins, titles, and population increases. All Guilds start small and to really capitalize on progression need to have all members working towards progression. The final level gives all of your guild members the Platinum Glowing armor set with your Guild crest/logo displayed on it. This armor set will be in your inventory as long as you belong to your Guild and can be used in individual matches as well.

So, what’s the timeline for all of this? Because we are understaffed we are going to release Guilds in several QA stages. The first stage is Closed Beta. All of our current Closed Beta members and all those that played in the ESL Trial Cup will be invited to the Closed Beta. It should take about a week or so to test out and fix any bugs found during this stage. Once finished, we will reset the Guilds and be in Open Beta and invite everyone to participate. At the end of Open Beta we will have a reward for the Guild that progressed the furthest. Open Beta will probably be for 30 days. A reset will depend on if any major bugs that gave any particular Guild an advantage during this period and your input as well.

Again, I really do apologize for not keeping up on communication while deep in the trenches. I have now poked my head up and am hear to answer questions and to be more engaged as I hang up my developer hat and put on my community hat :)


You can also view it directly on our dev diary: http://www.playforge...nt-page/guilds/

-Remy
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#2
Rue

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the post says that guild will be release in several stages, and that first stage (closed beta) will take a few weeks, followed by Open Beta, which will take at the minimum, a month (though i'm guessing probably several months).

but there's no statement about when exactly closed beta is starting?

so in reality, i'm guessing it will probably take 3-4 months before guild is actually released as a working feature in the game after all the quality assurance.
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#3
Remztan

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Yes, it's possible it will be in open beta for a while. However, while in open beta it will be released with the current client on steam. So really, we'll be releasing it very soon but labeling it as a "Beta Feature" so that everyone will be more understanding if there are any bugs. Does that make sense :)

#4
Rue

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so when is closed beta officially starting ?
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#5
Yezzdia

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Well at least we are getting some kind of feedback on what the devs are working on. I am pretty excited to see what all of the different rewards will be. Thanks for the post!

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#6
Anebriate

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Thanks for the write-up, Remztan.

I'm a little concerned about what I'm reading, though. I can't imagine there's a great demand for CTR-based guilds... so I would be curious to hear why it has become a priority. From my experience playing and talking with other veterans, it is more or less ignored, because it's not as competitive. The fact that the relic carrier can die with virtually no consequence (or far too small of a consequence, anyway) makes it just a glorified game of KotH with 1 person dispatched to retrieve the relic on each side. The fact that you have to pile onto the tower with sheer number advantage rather than any skill advantage also reduces its competitive viability.

Also, class compositions are not very balanced around CTR. 3 wardens, 2 shamans is probably the perfect comp. All that said... why not try to make 5v5 arenas work with guilds instead?
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#7
Denaszune

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I agree with Anebriate. I'm not sure people will want to play CTR. I think more people would enjoy TDM if arenas are not a possibility.
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#8
RentableDwarf

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I can't imagine there's a great demand for CTR-based guilds... so I would be curious to hear why it has become a priority.

Because they recognize that in order for a game to become big in the PVP scene, you need objectives besides just killing the enemy players. Objectives create the need for teamwork and therefore provide a basis for setting guilds apart. It is true that CTR is mostly a KoTH game, but with some minor tweaks I think it could become a good game mode for competitive play.

#9
Anebriate

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Because they recognize that in order for a game to become big in the PVP scene, you need objectives besides just killing the enemy players. Objectives create the need for teamwork and therefore provide a basis for setting guilds apart. It is true that CTR is mostly a KoTH game, but with some minor tweaks I think it could become a good game mode for competitive play.

I'm not sure that's true, strictly speaking. But for the sake of argument, if it was true, then there's no sense integrating it into guilds before the necessary "tweaks" are made.
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#10
Razius

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Because they recognize that in order for a game to become big in the PVP scene, you need objectives besides just killing the enemy players. Objectives create the need for teamwork and therefore provide a basis for setting guilds apart. It is true that CTR is mostly a KoTH game, but with some minor tweaks I think it could become a good game mode for competitive play.


Competition is what's needed for a PvP game to become "BIG", objectives are for pubs or Mobas.
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#11
Yezzdia

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Competition is what's needed for a PvP game to become "BIG", objectives are for pubs or Mobas.


Usually I'm all up for objectives, but this game really does strive in it's skillful deathmatch PvP, so I'd have to say that Arena or TDM is the better mode, but I'm still okay with CTF, tbh.
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#12
FearHAVOK

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I'm not sure that's true, strictly speaking. But for the sake of argument, if it was true, then there's no sense integrating it into guilds before the necessary "tweaks" are made.


I love reading everything you post, its always right.

#13
RentableDwarf

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Competition is what's needed for a PvP game to become "BIG", objectives are for pubs or Mobas.

Objectives drive competition and they set apart the pros from the scrubs. Are you really going to bash mobas though? Mobas have been highly successful for years and they're not really slowing down. Objectives are part of every popular game. Games like TF2 and CS have staple game modes that continue to draw crowds because they're objective focused. RTS games generally have many objectives on the map and they too are a massive part of the PC gaming world. Game modes that are objective driven will absolutely drive competition.

#14
thatguywhosnameisY

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Objectives drive competition and they set apart the pros from the scrubs. Are you really going to bash mobas though? Mobas have been highly successful for years and they're not really slowing down. Objectives are part of every popular game. Games like TF2 and CS have staple game modes that continue to draw crowds because they're objective focused. RTS games generally have many objectives on the map and they too are a massive part of the PC gaming world. Game modes that are objective driven will absolutely drive competition.


I agree. But CTR won't do it. Sorry =/

( Y )


#15
Rue

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yet another example of why communications is so important? :)

maybe there needs to be a representative for the community so this way the devs can just make sure to talk to this person every other day to ensure they have a good idea of what exactly the community as a whole is asking for. perhaps it's too hard for them to listen to everyone's opinion. maybe we need to vote for a figure head and have him be the voice of the people.

i vote for Django!
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#16
Yezzdia

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yet another example of why communications is so important? :)

maybe there needs to be a representative for the community so this way the devs can just make sure to talk to this person every other day to ensure they have a good idea of what exactly the community as a whole is asking for. perhaps it's too hard for them to listen to everyone's opinion. maybe we need to vote for a figure head and have him be the voice of the people.

i vote for Django!


As long as that representative is open to debate I don't really care who it is. Django for Forge Pres 2013?
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#17
Rue

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Django - for the people, by the people
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#18
Razius

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Objectives drive competition and they set apart the pros from the scrubs. Are you really going to bash mobas though? Mobas have been highly successful for years and they're not really slowing down. Objectives are part of every popular game. Games like TF2 and CS have staple game modes that continue to draw crowds because they're objective focused. RTS games generally have many objectives on the map and they too are a massive part of the PC gaming world. Game modes that are objective driven will absolutely drive competition.


You pointed out exactly what I said. Objectives are succesfull when is fun to achieve them and when it requires skill or teamwork or strategy. Grabbing a relic and running as fast as you can is none of those things so, if CTR will be the main "competitive" deal, is not going to work. For what I see, Forge could have had no CTR, no KOTH and , instead, team arenas, and it would have been way better: the gameplay itself is what brought me, and a lot of other players, here and is what makes forge a unique and incredibly fun game to play; all games have relics, towers, point to defend, and point to capture; but no other game has Forge's system of skillbased, fast peaced pvp combat with blocking, sprinting, aiming and, trust me , I've searched a lot around: there's not even one game that gets close.

The best way of highlighting this true masterpiece (the gameplay) is having modes that make this system the main component and not drive people away from using abilities because they can just "RUN".
Now here you may say that the devs should "fix" CTR and change it in a way that it'll be more fun to play and will allow more teamwork so that everything would make sense in a competitive scenario but.... this is where the problem is: it's obvious that they are running low on funds and ,as you can see, they are taking months for a guild system so, at this point, ask yourself if it's even possible for DVG's team right now to drastically change CTR and make it suitable for competitive.... before the Guild patch comes out.... I hope they really manage to come out of this big mess because the situation is no the greatest at all: CTR as the main deal inside the guild system is not gonna help, but you'll see it by yourself.
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#19
Yezzdia

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I'm okay with koth and ctr as modes to dick around on, which is fair to say for most, I think, but it just really doesn't work for forge in the competitive scene.

Games like cs and tf2 have a completely different play style than forge which is why those game modes work so well. It just isn't right for Forge's competitive scene

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#20
Jroc

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Needs moar team ranked arena.
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